For Sale Section

[J4P RX]

Has anyone got any thoughts about splitting it into cars for sale and parts for sale.

Was just browsing it looking for cars, and its kind of interwoven at the moment. Seems to be about 50/50 split so they wouldnt look too empty split apart :)

Lee

[grinder]

thats how it is done on the rx7club.com forum

much neater in my eyes

[scooby_si]

cant be a bad idea although it's not like they vanish off page 1 in a few hours (check out scoobynet that is scary! http://burns.thefinaldimension.org/contrib/tweetz/scared.gif)
Si

[Glenn Butcher]

We can look at doing this if you like after we move to v3 of the forum - I'm trying not to make too many changes at the moment.

Do other people think it is a good idea? please post here.

[20B_boy]

Can any one sell a car on MRC? or do they have to be members...?

[Fishy]

Rich, I think it should be something along the lines of, if they are traders in the rotary scene then fine. If they are non-rotary traders they should either pay or be removed, as they are not really offering a service to the community.

I think (flame suit on) that traders should support the forums by getting themselves a banner ad.

If its an andividual selling their car for the purpose of getting a rotary, all the better. But if they are just trying to advertise it for the sale, then something might need to be looked at.

Dan

[20B_boy]

I agree Danny (I think), I dont think any one should be able to chuck their car on here. Sooner or later some one buys a car they see on here from some unscrupulous hick, it goes :censored::censored::censored::censored: up and they are left with a bad taste in their mouths and it reflects badly on MRC...

If people wanna sell their cars on here they should be members.

I personally think traders should either be charged for advertising cars and parts or at least have bona-fide paid for advertising in place like Brian. Either way, they are giving some thing back to the club to help finance our outings and things like Rotorstock etc. Otherwise I think its a bit rude personally...

[J4P RX]

I have mixed views...

Traders and members no problem. But then you have the established poster who isnt actually a member (maybe they should join!) and those that just seem to appear to sell things.

Now if an established non member posts their car for sale then maybe thats not too bad. I dont think they will want to join if they are selling it! At least you may know a little background on the person selling the car etc.

Its when people clearly come with the intetion to sell that bothers me. Trouble is, I wouldnt like to miss out on a potential bargain on some parts or a car either.

Its a difficult one in my opinion.

Lee

Edit, by traders I meant people paying for banners etc. Not just any old trader :)

[20B_boy]

Like you say Lee, if they are an established poster then they should probably join!

I think cars for sale by members only. Traders fine as long as they are putting some thing back - its not a lot to ask for A LOT of targetted advertising!!

[clive]

Whilst we are on this subject, how about this one as well Parts vendors !

We recently had one approach the club for a banner ad but stated quite clearly that without a huge discount he would not pay the clubs set fee.

He was turned down on the grounds of, if we do that for one it would then quite clearly not be fair to the people paying the correct set fee.

We are a non profit making Club and not a business and we would like to think that anyone buying a banner would also be doing it to support our club because these fees as Rich says would act go towards making meeting etc better for it's members.

To put this into prospective we charge around 20% less for a year than Japanese Performance would charge for a half page advert for one month !

So rather than pay our fee this person now packs his posts out with as much advertising as he can rather than pay the club money !.

As we are now 3rd in the top 150 Rotary sites they would surely get coverage for their company by virtue of the amount of people that now visit our site.

So as this club likes to have as much member imput as it can [ it's your club] do we carry on letting various Vendors use the forum for free advertising on their posts for their company's or should our Moderators edit out any advertising other than their email / web address ???????????????????????????????????

[20B_boy]

As I said in my earlier post - PARTS included IMO...

WTF should any one get free advertising, especially when its such a targetted audience. If a vendor doesnt want to pay a few quid for a banner/the right to advertise stuff generally then my feeling is that they shouldnt be allowed to advertise more than their contact details, end of.

Have a Vendors For Sale section or summut so only paying companies can post what they want to get shot of. Aint nothing for free in this world!!

As memberships grow so will the admin costs - personally I dont think its unreasonable to ask the vendors (whom I imagine make significant sales due to MRC/FDUK) to meet these spiralling costs in one way or another!

Rant over :)

[scooby_si]

i can see the logic of wanting only members to post but i dont agree this is the way it should be. Sure you may get people trying to sell shyte & i can think of a few examples but it's always buyer beware in any such aquisition. The big loss with doing such a system is as mentioned the fact the members/users may & WILL miss out on some good deals. For example with group buys & such like if you can only post if yer a member then noone else can post good deals on there this type of board seems conter productive to me as for example if i wanted to point say members of a certain supra board to a nice deal going then i have to join up which i aint guna do they dont get chance to get onboard a good deal & the group buy has less chance of getting decent numbers.
Just the way i see it but if some1 has something worth selling then i wana have every opportunity to see it & if it's a POS then that is to a degree down to the buyer to check for it's their money after all :D
Si

[g11ary]

Group buys would not get stopped coz its not stopping members posting that there is a group buy. Its just stopping some members that you only see on here when they want to sell some thing and generally have no imput to the club. If traders had to be a member or pay for the advert, you as a fellow mrc'er can still say " hey guys great deal going down on a group buy". You wont ever stamp out free advertising coz lots of members will always push members towards friends or particullar people selling goods, but at least you can make the blatent sellers pay for it. How would you like free entry to RotorStock in 2 or 3 years time, possible if mrc has enough money in the bank. No reason that in a couple of years MRC shop can be evolved. These same dealers would not lose out coz if competetive they may well supply mrc.

If mrc grew to big as big as usa forum they could introduce the mrc credit card and earn a % on every sale made. feasable.

[Fishy]

I think the difference between a group buy and a vendor is the group buy is run by one person, going to different vendors trying to get the best price. Not a vendor doing discounts on products.

A vendor on the other hand will just offer there products at there price. If vendors were to offer a special of the month it might be nicer, but none offer this. Not much incentive to use them IMO.

The only thing that stops people getting stuff abroad is the some of the horror storys. I have done it and will continue to do it.

Dan

[johnf]

Might as well add my thoughts.............

I joined MRC to gain help, advice and support from like minded people all having the same passion and I sleep better knowing there is help out there if I need it.

If, for a variety of reasons i.e. modding, wheel cahnges etc some member's unwanted parts go up for sale this is an ideal site for them to sell and I thinks thats good, benefitting other members.

However if a dedicated trader wants to promote his 'BUSINESS' through the site I think they should pay. I can't think of a way of advertising my business services to a specific target audience FREE and I would expect to pay.

There are of course grey areas - lets say I design a wonderfull new spoiler and go into production offering it to members. Now I'm not a trader, this being a little sideline, so would it be acceptable for me to promote this on the forum free? I would say no.

With the rapid growth of imports could the balance of the forum change to a sales site, with our 'For Sale' section developing into 'the place' to look for a rotary and become known country wide.

I don't know the answers but I do think some rules and regulations should be discussed and implimented sooner rather than later.


John

[20B_boy]

Well said John.

Now, hands up who wants to be a 'For Sale' Nazi? :D

For Vendors I think its a case of:

you dont cough up and you have an entry in the vendors section giving your contact details, end of.

you cough up and you can advertise specific items for sale in a seperate section may be, or how about x-p per advert?!!

I'm with you John about 'sidelines'; its some of these guys that are the worries IMO, I'm all for free enterprise and all that but the many popping up from no where selling stuff from their 'bedrooms' should be well sheriffed... if you wanna sell stuff using MRC as your means of advertising then you pay for the priviledge...

[J4P RX]

OK an idea...

How about we make the Vendors section only availble for posts by those users that have a Banner Ad? If someone needs information about the parts/cars advertised then they can contact the vendor directly.

Alternativly, posts in that area could be moderatined before they are available to the public.

Anyone who is clearly a vendor who then posts elsewhere will have that post removed???

As for individuals selling things (not companys) I kind of like it how it is. If the vendors have genuine personal parts for sale then they could still post them here.

Lee

[johnf]

Lee

I think you used a very good phrase

"Genuine Personal Parts"

It shouldn't be too hard to seperate the items for sale using that rule.

[grinder]

just my £0.02 worth

if you have a trader who is selling parts - they offer them 2 choices

1 - pay for the banner adds
2 - MRC want a percentage of sales revenue

probs with choice two is how to moderate it - thats the killer

although this gives the traders the choice :-

1 - pay for a banner and get no sales ( no no )
2 - pay for a banner and get loads of sales ( keeps them happy )
3 - Pay 10% ( for example ) to the MRC for what they sell ( if no sale then no fee )
4 - pay 10% to the MRC and sell loads - could cost more than a banner add

i think to give a choice of "no banner no sale" - you could end up scaring a possible source of revenue away

if they dont know much about the club , why would they fork out XXX pounds for a banner - i know i wouldnt - but i would offer a percentage of what i sell , then the following year , i would re-look at the situation and work from that point

not sure if this is do-able - but its another avenue to look down

Thanks

Stu

( Already has coat in hand and ready to leave if this turns nasty )

[J4P RX]

if they dont know much about the club , why would they fork out XXX pounds for a banner

I presume they get information on the traffic flow through the site, or at least could ask for such things.

Cheers
Lee

[grinder]

this is true i suppose !!

i still think that there could be a simple solution to this ! - and we cant see the wood for the tree's !

3rd option let them pay on a month basis ( unless thats how it works ) - they pay a set up fee and then pay a monthly cost ( with the ability to change the adds )

i still think to get a company to pay for advertising is really hard on the net - i set up my own business doing something similar - and people dont want to pay to be seen on a site - they need a better incentive

the pay monthly thing could work - they can cancel at anytime and it always seems cheaper ( say £20 per month ) - although not sure what you guys charge anyways !!

you get them to set up a standing order ( no DD charges then ) - its all simple and they dont fork out a huge amount straight away - its a safe way to test the water

you can then do deals - pay up front for a year and get it at 85% cost , get 6 months for the price of 5 - it always looks like they get a bargain at the end of the day

its like a buy one get one free for something - the company still makes a profit and you get a bargain - every one is happy !!

[g11ary]

Guys keep it simple, dont give choices, you need a platform to work from. Had a builder in here, wanted 20 bathrooms, ordered them and on the day of delivery wanted to pay for them after selling the houses. #1 dont bank roll poeple, let them use there own bank, % and pay at end of yr, forget, every now and then you simply wont see it, choices give poeple excusses. #2 if a business man see's x views or members on a forum its not rocket science to weigh up the pro's and con's of advertising on that forum. #3 introduce for instance banner ads only to start and then as the advertising and forum grows slowly add ideas and grow, to much to fast. Rules that apply to one must apply to another, so treat traders the same as sideliners. Make yourself a very good disclaimer, and do not make recommendations, if it goes :censored::censored::censored::censored: up you can be liable for that recommendation.

[g11ary]

good idea to let them pay month by dd. save a lot of hasle, cheaper opion to pull out and smaller outlay. But start on banners and then introduce ideas. No banner no advertising. Then move on.

[grinder]

so baiscally have a set price for a banner - end of story ?

if so - cunning plan i like it !

but what happens in 6 months and its not working - it needs a rethink - so what happens to the people who have already paid ( if any )

wouldnt the club loose out if it was a fixed price - they are buying space on a site that may close tommorrow - where is there security ?

you need a VERY well worded disclaimer ( for down time etc.. )

i just think that its a hard rule to follow and may loose possibly advertisers

[grinder]

just out of intertest are there advertisers knocking on the door - or is this to try and sort it before it starts ?

[g11ary]

any ads brought down would be on a prorata basis and good idea for pay monthly so that then would not be a problem. Introduce banners and then intro addition ideas not replacements. Just think you need to walk for running.

[Carl]

As a vendor on this site I think if I get charged for advertising in the vendors section I should stop posting any free advice on the forum.
I think I will get people to pay for it in future.That way I can offset my costs for advertising.
I just think that the club already has rules on advertising that work.The Banners are paid for and the vendors section is free.
Why are we trying to make life complicated,I think that no one is abusing the priviledge.
This is a club,not a business(Yet)if we go that far then Clive and Lisa should get paid for all the work they are doing and so should the moderators.
Come on lads,lets keep it a club.
I am a member because I love the rotary first and foremost and try my best to help as many as possible with their cars,it's not allways about business you know.
Kind regards
Carl
:(

[scooby_si]

But i still feel for anyone who isn't a trader as such, they should be totally free to put an advert on for soemthing they want to sell regardless of their post counts & such like. Sure if it becomes obvious they are purely selling their products & that's all their doing then it maybe worth having a word to check it aint a professional ttrying their luck but if it's just someone who say lurks http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/Lurking.gif or doesn't fancy posting as freely as some of us http://smilies.crowd9.com/cwm/cwm/nerd.gif doesn't mean they should be barred from using the facilities as i feel having plenty of nice goodies for sale is a benefit to the members who use the site.
Sure i realise it all needs to be funded which is where the companies which can benefit from the publicity come in but i feel any other non professional types shouldn't be limited to how they can use it (unless it is innappropriate to the community or the board)
All IMO & based largely on the popularity of the for sale section on scoobynet which despite it being badly set up in terms of space & the fact threads disappear off the page in a matter of hours is a very good place for member who are registered or even not to find bargains & desired goodies
The sticky on that section is as follows & i think covers most eventuallities nicely:
The Scoobynet "FOR SALE" forum is for non-commercial private sales only. If you wish to advertise commercially on Scoobynet please contact webmaster@scoobynet.co.uk or shaun@scoobynet.co.uk to discuss Banner Ads or Scoobyshop.
All posts and threads within the "FOR SALE" forum must only contain information pertaining to the advertising of goods, or the request for information about such goods. Replies to adverts complaining / questioning the price or quality of the goods are harmful and often misleading and are therefore not allowed. For this reason, "buyer beware" is also an important consideration.

"For Sale" posts, linking to references on sites such as Ebay, is also not allowed. Posts containing such links will be edited.

This Forum is a service provided for Registered Scoobynet Members only, and should not be used to offer goods on behalf of a third party. Any such threads will be deleted.

Scoobynet takes no responsibility for any transactions being made between seller and buyer.

Any posting that contravenes any of the above, will result in immediate removal without explanation. Repeat offending may result in your details being published and further action (including legal action) taken.

Your posting within this forum indicates you acceptance of these terms.



Just a few of my thoughts as i have purchased many goodies from there privately & i feel a large degree of freedom where not abused is very good for members of the board.
Si (yes i do occasional have thoughts http://smilies.jeeptalk.org/cwm/cwm/silly.gif lol)

[20B_boy]

Was any thing concluded about this at all?

[g11ary]

No I thnk it died when Carl posted. Personally I think Carl you should charge for your expertise and dont give all the secrets away, you are in business to earn money the same as me and everyone else posting, Im sure if the boot was on the other foot many of the IT boffs on here would not come and set my all singing web site up foc. There is a difference between being helpful and letting poeple take the p**s. Fine line. I would not go on an ceramics forum and tell everyone where I import all my goods and IT guys would not go on line and offer there software for free.

[20B_boy]

In my mind the aims are to:

1) Regulate/police the For Sale/Vendors sections to ensure traders/people arent taking the :censored::censored::censored::censored: out of the forum, and that 'dodgy' people arent freely able to use the forum to conduct their 'business' at MRC's cost.

2) To generate income as would any other self-funding club by getting some thing back from those that benefit from it financially i.e. the traders on here.

Carl, I hear what yer saying, but surely a few quid a year to pay for such targetted advertising space isnt a lot to ask of any of the 'specialists' or other vendors who choose to use MRC to flaunt their services and products?

If those who then pay dont see fit to give free advice then thats their prerogative of course, although it seems a bit of a contradiction when you say "it's not all about business"?

This is aimed at all Vendors/Traders, NOT Carl in particular I must point out.

I just dont see it should be a big problem for those making money out of the club and its members to put a bit more back into the club than their annual subscription (where paid!).

I'm sure the trade thats picked up 'just about' covers the expenditure...no such thing as a free lunch boys, come on :)

[Carl]

Oohh Gary! My illusions have been shattered!!
There was me thinking that you spent hours making all your tiles by hand and painting all the intricate designs on them,now you go and tell us you buy them ready made.
Well I think that my life will never be the same again.I can't bear to look at my bathroom tiles at the moment,how am I going to sleep tonight?Somebody help me,I can't cope with all that this means from now on.
Next you'll be telling me the milkman doesn't make his own milk or that the water in my tap comes from a big lake somewhere and steak is just some animal by product.
Help,I do not know what to believe anymore.
Carl:rollin

[bnaellis]

wow just read through this lot, I think my head hurts.:confused:
This is a sticky issue, and makes things become too political I won't add to the comments but yes Lee I think a parts section would be benefical.

rgds

[20B_boy]

All hail Brian, contributor of 100%(?) of MRC's advertising revenue!

All hail Brian!!

:) :D ;)