Won't start

[martinFD]

Ok,

Had a new rebuilt engine put in a few weeks back, car has been running fine since.

Got up sunday morning to drop a bird off (successfull saturday night), car started as usual, started reversing out the drive and stalled. I'm putting this down to clutch rather than a problem. Anyway, since stalling I have not been able to get the car started again.

It turns over pretty well so I'm sure there no compression issues (new engine ffs). While turning over it sometimes pops. I have managed to get it started breifly, although it sounds rough, probably running on 1 rotor. However, it dies after a few seconds.

It's very smokey from the exhaust, although it always has been due to a very rich fuel setup at present. It doesn't smell of coolant, and I would be suprised if the seals went after 2 weeks of use!

Other factors which might be relevant. The car was running with a leak from the radiator although I was monitoring this, and actually fixed it on the saturday. Was just a loose hose clip.

I'm hoping that the problem is one of the following.

1. The damp cold weather is interferring with the ignition some how.

2. The rich mixture has fouled the plugs. New plugs, so would again be surprised if it happened so quickly.

3. Bad earthing


Whats the easiest way to diagnose this problem??


Cheers,
Lenny

[Bobfish]

Dude, i feel for you i really do - stalling like that when taking a girl home! haha

Do you have compression pulses when you turn the car over or does it just whirr? If its just whirring, your engines flooded - follow unflooding procedure. Flooding is common on new motors because they make low compresison. The popping you describe would also be indicative of flooding. So would the smoke from the exhaust.

However, what you say about it starting on one rotor is unfortunately indicative of a blown coolant seal. Its not impossible for the coolant seals to be incorrectly installed at rebuild which makes them fail quickly.

remove the plugs and check them for anything abnormal. They will probably be wet though as the car is being cranked but not started so they will be covered with fuel.

Check the plugs for spark, get an HT lead tester. Next thing is make sure the car is getting fuel. Easiest check is to crank the car for a few seconds and then smell the exhaust, if it stinks of fuel then its ok.

If you have spark and fuel, id suggest its a blown motor im afraid, althought i would be highly surpised if its anything other than a coolant seal. Did the car behave ok when you drove it the night before? Is it warrantied?

[martinFD]

Thanks for you input Bobfish, I hope your wrong!!

Yes, the engine is warrantied. Although it would entail a £500 each way shipping cost to the US! Might be cheaper to have a local specialist look at replacing the seal.

Anyone want to hazzard a guess at a cost?

[martinFD]

It turns out it's possible someone (to remain unknown) put an unknown amount of screenwash in the coolant. Would that corrode the water seal??

If that's a possiblity, then I might have a case to have the "unknown" person help with the bill!

Cheers!

[Bobfish]

haha you pellet putting screenwash in your coolant.

flush the coolant ASAP, get that **** out of there. Not sure it could corrode the seals, but it certainly isnt going to help.

a cost for replacing a coolant seal is going to be the same as an engine rebuild im afraid my friend. you have to pull the engine apart.

[martinFD]

Lol, I can say hand on heart that it wasn't me putting screenwash in there!! I use Avian minerialised water only :P

Presumably a water system pressure test would expose a faulty water seal?

[dre]

I think you are jumping to conclusions with the water seal failure. When i flooded mine I only took out the rear rotor plugs, cleaned them up took the EGI fuse out, turned the car over for 3 20 second bursts to clear out the fueld soaked chambers, cleaned and warmed up the plugs replaced everything and it fired up!! :flamed

It was still a bit difficult to start cos i only done the 1 rotor and should have done both and it did sound like a tractor for a couple of mins but if you keep the revs up over 2,000 it'll burn off all the excess fuel.

When turning the key i found mine needed a bit of gas as it was firing up!! :flamed

Hope this helps! :cool

[martinFD]

Cheers dre, I prefer your more positive outlook on things :)

If it turns out the seals gone, I'll be putting the whole car in the crusher so I can make bake bean cans out of it.

[nikp]

Yeah, just sounds like it's flooded. When you manage to start a flooded rex, it does run rough for a while, and there is a lot of smoke for a bit (While it burns off all the extra petrol). When it does fire, you have to get on the throttle quick to keep the revs up to stop it from stalling, otherwise it will flood again.

Take the plugs out, turn her over for a bit with your foot flat on the loud pedal (This stops petrol being chucked in). That will chuck the extra petrol out. Dry off oyu existing plugs (or get brand new ones) chuck them in and have another go.

[martinFD]

Cheers guys,

Will give this a try asap. Hate these dark evenings! Whats the best way to clean the plugs?

[nikp]

Yuo can get away with not cleaning them up - depends how fouled they are. The best way to clean them is with a really really hot flame - burn all the deposits off!

[vz-r_dave]

ive had problems with mine for weeks now.

same as the above. It took a tow start top get mine going, drove it for two days and tried to start it one morning and it wont start. I have to get the plugs out and check them because it was starting no problems when hot. Cold weather and **** plugs doesnt go lol

[Martiny]

Have you tried turning the key with the acc pedal fully depressed?

[dre]

LOL!! :rollin :rollin :rollin

Let us know how you get on. It happened to me the second day after i picked mine up and i thought to myself, "here we go again"!!

I'm sure all is fine :yes

[martinFD]

I'll try the open throttle approach first, if that doesn't work I'll start ripping the plugs out.

Thanks for all the input ladies...

[Bobfish]

Do you have compression pulses when you turn the car over or does it just whirr? If its just whirring, your engines flooded - follow unflooding procedure. Flooding is common on new motors because they make low compresison. The popping you describe would also be indicative of flooding. So would the smoke from the exhaust.


thats why i asked that Q! I guessed he had compression pulses...

If you need help, give me a shout. Your welcome to my number if you want some gratis telephone support.

When my engine floods, i just pull out the main circuit relay, and crack the f*cker over. It stops the injectors operating and just chucks all the fuel out of the exhaust ports. I dont take my spark plugs out or anything, thats huge hassle. If my engine floods i can un flood it in about 5 minutes as opposed to 30.

[martinFD]

Put the battery on charge at lunch, so will be giving it a try later.

Can't say I paid much attention to how the engine sounded. Having not had a working engine for some 14 months, I've forgotten what it's suppose to sound like!!

Appreciate the offer Bobfish. :cheers

[Bobfish]

well mine sounds like an electric drill when its flooded i.e whiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiir instead of like a pulsing sound when you try and start it.

Seriously though, flush that coolant straight away get rid of that screenwash.

Also, you can test your coolant seals quite simply when its running again. Let the car cool completely, remove the coolant filler cap to release any pressure/vacuum in the coolant system. Replace cap. Start car, leave it to run for about a minute. Shut it off. Squeeze the hose coming off the bottom of the filler neck - if its hard (i.e system has pressure in) you probably have a bad seal. To be sure, remove the cap and smell the filler neck. If you have some smoke lingering in there and it smells of exhaust, its your seals.

If not, good!! haha.

[martinFD]

I'm happy to report that I got it running at the weekend. Basically just took a load of fuel out the map on idle. Started almost instantly. Been running well since. Got a wideband hooked up and I'm running at 11.7-11.9 on idle which is way too rich. Unfortunately I'm not sure how I'm going to solve that with my fuel setup. Going to hit the Datalogit archives and see what I can dig up!

On another note, I still can't drive my car as the water coolant light (and totally annoying beep) always comes on. I've put water in ever hole there is and it doesn't appear to be losing any. I'm pretty sure there isn't an air lock as the heaters are still kicking out hot air. What are the chances of a faulty sensor??

[Newera]

If your car's running an uprated ECU it's possible it's flooded.

Clean the plugs with a decent wire brush and check the gaps before putting them back on the car.

When the (4) plugs are out, pull out the main fuse for the ignition and crank it over... You should see lots of petrol getting sprayed out.

Leave the engine with no plugs in overnight or for a day or so (In this cold weather), if you can - so the fuel can evaporate.

Get new plugs if they look old, to save yourself the bother of fouling the plugs again very soon.

If your exhaust has a sweet smell of antifreeze when it first starts, then your water seals may be faulty, but unusual on a recent rebuild, assuming the person assembling did it right.

Miguel

[FD3UK]

What fuel setup do you have? You mentioned datalogit and wideband so you will be able set up fuelling. Your idle AFR is not far off the money as 12 is about right for idle on a rotary.

If you feel that coolant is at correct level you should check coolant level switch and wiring. If you disconnect the wiring plug near the switch and use a piece of wire to short between the connector and engine block the buzzer/light should go out. This will point to a faulty switch which should be replaced.


Kev

[martinFD]

What fuel setup do you have? You mentioned datalogit and wideband so you will be able set up fuelling. Your idle AFR is not far off the money as 12 is about right for idle on a rotary.

If you feel that coolant is at correct level you should check coolant level switch and wiring. If you disconnect the wiring plug near the switch and use a piece of wire to short between the connector and engine block the buzzer/light should go out. This will point to a faulty switch which should be replaced.


Kev

Excellent, thanks for that information Kev. Will give it a try.

I'm running 1000cc pri/1600sec with a denso Supra TT pump and a FPR. Fuel pressure is 40psi.

[FD3UK]

Are you running PFC and Datalogit? You should take some fuelling out of the cranking map to help with your flooding problems.

Is 40psi your base fuel pressure with vacuum hose connected or disconnected?

I am running 82LB(860cc) primarys on Microtech and I find 11.5AFR is about the best for me at 1200rpm for idle.

Hope the test solves your buzzer problems

Kev

[AJAY]

Hi I Changed The Plug Leads On My Rx7 And After That It Dont Wanna Start Iv Rang Mazda Just Incase I Put Them On Wrong But It Seems That Iv Put Them On Rite The Car Just Turnes Over Pops Trys To Start For A Sec Or So Then Dies Could U Pls Help Me With Anyting U Think May Bethe Problem Thanks Aj