RX323 Project - Chassis Brackets

[MikeLMR]

well its back in one piece and is probably as good an example as you could hope to find in the UK. The bottom of the OSF wing is toast but its not a major pain to repair with the panels being bolt on.

I really need to sort the suspension now ... I can live with having no power but 20mph and white knuckles around roundabouts is no fun ... exciting but not fun !

trying to find out what bolts in from the Aussies, i'm hoping i can use a full strut from a S2 rx7 on the front as that'd upgrade the brakes, shocks and springs in one fell swoop. It's crying out for a nice set of dished old school wheels. Might give weller a call ... 13x7's should do :D (might be a bit OTT actually!)

[Richard]

Good news there Mike.:D Now the enjoyable bit planning the upgrades, eh?

I've been watching these on Ebay and thought they might suit you. 7 x 13's as well. The down side is they're 2/3 the price of the car.:(

http://i21.ebayimg.com/01/i/03/d4/55/a2_1_b.JPG

What calipers do the S2 run - single or 2 pots? May have to change the master cylinder as well?

To finish off the front suspension upgrade you'll need the anti roll bar from an estate- half as much diameter again as the standard.
Where to get one ? - well it just so happens ...........:rollin

As for the rear, I ran Spax adjustables- I recon it'd be worth giving them a ring, as I think they can remake any of their old patterns.

Best of luck, and I shall be following this with interest.

Rich;)

[flectron]

hey rich they look cool!

will they fit on either of mine? and any chance of a link?

cheers,
gord.

ps. congrats mike and welcome to the club :cool
although i think 1st gen owners should already be in it - otherwise we're gonna be tooo exclusive..

go the old-skool :)

[MikeLMR]

if they are 4x110 and the correct offset (not sure for old school cars ? around 20mm ET ? ... depends on the width) they should fit ... can't find those on ebay, they must be under an odd description. They look like early compomotive wheels ?

[Brett]

If you mean 2nd gen when you say S2, then they are 4 pot calipers. If thats not what you meant I will shut up and withdraw from the area! :D

Nica mota Mike :wave

[MikeLMR]

S2 = series 2 sorry for any confusion.



I have some series 5 4 pots that are not destined for this car as they won't fit under 13" rims (+single pots should be more than enough to stop this feather weight!)

[MikeLMR]

found them ... they are ford stud pattern i.e 2mm out for the mazda (don't like the idea of that)

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=28648&item=7974736650&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

[Richard]

I've been running the Ford PCD wheels on my cars for 20 years + and never had any worries:D ( even down those wonderful Irish lanes:cool )

The one difference tho' is that I converted them all to studs instead of bolts;)

It would be quite easy to make up your own big brake conversion. The caliper mount bracket is only a flat steel plate which bolts to the strut, a la RX2. You could make up a new one to accomodate any disc diameter and caliper mount.

http://img65.exs.cx/img65/8480/brake19gv.th.jpg

http://img65.exs.cx/img65/5984/brake28be.th.jpg

Heres some brake options I've looked at (1000/1300 strut is slightly different in the mount department.)

Ford Group 4 Alloy Hub/ BMW vented disc/ Willwood Dynalite 4 pot

http://hometown.aol.co.uk/jmazdaman/images/4spot.jpg

http://hometown.aol.co.uk/jmazdaman/images/4pot.jpg

1000 Hub/ MX5 Vented Disc/ HiSpec Alloy Ford M16 Copy Caliper
http://publish.hometown.aol.co.uk/mazdaparts70s80s/images/finished3.jpg

Ive stuck with the 2 pot for the moment because of master cyl sizing probs.

When/ if I refit the disc braked English axle then I'll look at making a bias pedal box, and then the Princess 4 Pot copy would be an option. BTW studs have been shortened since this pic was taken:rolleyes:

Rich;)

[MikeLMR]

I might be tempted then (+ with the abundance of ford stud pattern and offset rims!)

What sort of width/offset were you running on your 323 ? even though this project isn't on till after the rx7 is 100% finished I might be tempted by some old school bling (and some decent suspension) as I will be using this car a fair bit over summer.

Were you using standard front stuts or does somthing better bolt in ?

[MikeLMR]

on the strut options. I am sat here looking at that 1100 front strut and I think the mounting at its base looks very similar to the rx7 one.

Do you think I could bolt up (or modify slightly) a s2 rx7 front strut complete but use the 323 top mount (or a hybrid) and then hopefully the ball joint tapers should match (IIRC the japanese have had a set of standard automotive tapers for a long while)

[mullins]

Only prob with the s2 strut is the resulting positive camber and you also end up with reduced spring travel.

I recommend trying to retro fit different discs and calipers to the 323 strut as above. The discs and calipers off the s2 could be adapted quite easily to the 323 strut

As for master cylinder RX-4 it a good upgrade for bigger discs.

[MikeLMR]

doh positive camber is bad ... i want a fair bit of negative camber on the front.

Whats the usual mod for the 323's then ? I've had a good look round it today poking holes (only found one or two soft bits and they are around previous repairs I already knew about) and I must say it needs some serious effort on the suspension side of things (I can fit under the car without jacking it up for a start!)

[MikeLMR]

looks like the rear shocks should be fairly simple to upgrade, just a question of finding some the correct length and re bushing to suit.

Does the S2 front strut definetly result in more positive camber ?

ie. \----/ and not /----\ surely as long as the stub axle is perpendicular to the strut and the mountings are the same top and bottom it should result in the same as standard camber/caster ?

What about rear springs ?

[MikeLMR]

Ok to answer my question.

S1-S3 struts sit at a steeper angle than the earlier rx's so retrofitting them results in less camber. apparently the S2&S3 struts aren't quite so bad as the S1 struts which result it +'tve camber.

Now I'm investigating if I can find some adjustable strut tops :) hehehe the search is never ending :D

*edit* might have founds some :D ace s2 front struts it might be :)

[Richard]

So many questions Mike:D

First up - wheels. I ran my 323 on Alleycats and KN Starmags in a 6 inch width with 185/60's( RAC road rally rules at the time :rolleyes: )

The ET of the Starmag's is 16 and a backspace of 102mm. Any more backspace than this and it gets a little too close to the front strut for comfort.

As mentioned earlier I ran an English axle which is 52 inches wide, compared to the 323's 54 inches IIRC, so I used a pair of 1 inch spacers behind the Starmags. On a standard axle I think you can run the rears with a bit more backspace, allowing you to maybe get a 7" under there. Just means you have to carry 2 spares:(

I sent the standard strut casings to Leda to be revalved, and used MK2 Escy springs at -1 inch and 180 lbs ( straight swap).

Leda can no longer carry out this service. Instead they cut off the tube and weld on their own tube/ rod assembley, and valve to your requirements. This also means that they are 2 1/4 coil overs, so theres a huge choic e of spring rates.

I ran standard springs on the rear and Spax adjustables.Give Spax a ring - I'm sure they can help you out.

If I were to build another one I'd fit Escy turrets in the back and use 2 1/4 coilovers. Bin those heavy bottom arms and springs, and make up some rose - jointed tie rods to fit into the original Mazda mounts. Save some weight and super adjustable:D

Rich;)

[MikeLMR]

yes lots of questions :D (I've split the thread from the other one if anyone is confused BTW)

Thanks very much for the answers ... I'm having a bit of scrounge round my mates now to see what wheels I can dig up + I have made enquiries about a brand new rx3 X-member (not genuine .. made in aus) ;)

[MikeLMR]

Right progress is being made :)

Got a set of 13x6 4x110 wheels from Kiwimazda in the post soon ;)

Sent a money order off to Aus the other day for a brand new RX3 type X member

and have a nice strut brace, sump guard and stiffer front ARB from the mazda parts guru ... Richard :cool


Still hunting down the rx7 struts and other bits n bobs for the suspension though. They are prooving more difficult to track down than really odd bits :confused:

[MikeLMR]

Wheels

[Richard]

Coolio alloys there Mike:cool

Do they have a choice of styles, for future reference?

One option that may have been of interest before you ordered the xmember is that of running a Ford front end.

I forgot to mention this at RS:( . I looked into it some years ago and it seemed pretty feasible.

Capri crossmember would have fitted in with about 5mm to spare either side. Admittedly you'd need to make engine mounts, but you'd have the luxury of a choice of front strut/brake (6R4 big enough?) set up, and also a quick rack.

Out of interest ,what sort of money do the '7' strut/brake set ups go for?

Keep up the good work:D

Rich;)

[MikeLMR]

Kiwimazda is a user on here :) (another UK mazda rally nut) ... I think the alloys are orginally from Aus and are called globes or somthing similar ?

The X-member is just for the engine mounts, the suspension x member is still left in place as in the rx3.

No idea how much a set of 7 struts are worth as I've not found any for sale yet. Whole cars don't fetch much ££'s so I doubt they are majorly expensive.

Only trouble is you need to change the strut tops or make them adjustable as the KPI is significantly different in the rx7.

[MikeLMR]

started taking some measurements today and trying things to see how they fit.

more piccies.

sump guard + strut brace
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0028small.jpg

Strut top plate in position
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0044small.jpg

Front strut out for measurements
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0034small.jpg

This is what the front end looks like on a 323 minus a strut
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0042small.jpg

and the strut tower itself
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0037small.jpg

the strut top attached to the front strut - the centre bolt is M12 fine and the PCD of the bolts is approx 130mm with the hole in the strut tower being just under 100mm in diameter
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0035small.jpg

Mike

[MikeLMR]

strut dimensions (measured with a ruler by my eye so not super accurate but close enough)

[Richard]

Some series 2 '7' hubs and 4 pots up for sale on Ebay there Mike.

Maybe the hubs will fit the 323 strut and make up a bracket for the calipers?

If so mod the strut body to go 2 1/4" - just a thought

Nice inner wing ther by the way:D

Rich;)

[MikeLMR]

I have some 4 pots already on the 'usefull spares' shelf in the garage, unfortunately there is no way they would fit under 13's

Cheers for the tip off on the struts ... will take a look see.

[MikeLMR]

got the wheels in the post today and they fit :) (only just with the std. front struts!)

I have to decide whether to get them refurbed or not now. I'm tempted to just clean them myself and run them as is for now. They have a couple of dings in the outer rim but the seat for the bead looks straight enough.

hmmm more decissions. (camera batteries are dead too so no pics :( )

I've had to remove the little screws in the rear drums to fit the rims though. I presum these are just to hold the drum to the axle while messing around with the bearings ?

[flectron]

great thread mike:cool
wish more people would blog their projects so diligently, it's very educational.
keep up the good work - soon you & Rich will be able to publish a guide to old-skool mazda modification:)

[MikeLMR]

sanded down and painted the wheels last night ( I remember now, why I hate painting things) hopefully they will last more than 5 minutes before the paint comes off :p

I might get some photos tonight (camera on charge now!) before I make an attempt for a second coat of paint.

noticed a slight problem with the alloys too ... one of them is a different offset to the other 3 ... well the numbers on the rim suggest it is, I havn't checked yet. I have 3 that say 13x6JJx19P and one that says 13x6JJx23P. If it measures out by 4mm I'll just have to make a spacer.

Does anyone else know if its safe to remove the small screws on the rear drums ? I can't see them doing a great deal appart from aiding assembly

[Richard]

:yes Mike - its fine to remove those screws.

What I would say tho is to keep them for when you adjust the brakes - they'll hold the drum square and central onto the half shaft, while you adjust each shoe individually.

Once you've done the brakes remove the screws, bolt on the wheels and these will clamp the drums in position. :D

Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

I think the wheels are just about ready for some tyres now ! These photos are about as close as I want to post of my 'handy' work with a paint can :D

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0047sml.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0049sml.jpg

Ordered some wheel studs and nuts as well + A single 5mm spacer ... will machine 1mm off it. I'll probably pin it to the wheel as well to stop it going adrift or being forgotten

I doubt 4mm would make much difference on the rear axle anyway ... the panhard rod would allow that much lateral movement over a short travel

[MikeLMR]

oh and is anyone else missing ausrotary :( ... been reading it a lot lately

[travellinbob]

Mike , I was on ausrotary about an hour ago??? I know that the direct link via my favourites isnt working but i can still access it via the good old history button on my compooter.
cheers, michael.

[MikeLMR]

damn ... just searched for it on google and its working once you get past the home page ... been lost for a few days now LoL

Cheers for that !

[Richard]

oh and is anyone else missing ausrotary :confused:

Just checked out the parts trader so works fine for me Mike.

Wheels will be a good contrast against the canary yellow :cool

The 323 disc and hub are 1 casting so when I fitted studs to the hub I drilled, tapped and fitted 4mm grub screws to hold the studs in position and stop them winding through when the wheel nuts are tightened. But I guess you 've already sussed that :D

Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

I was going to use stud lock ? These ones have 10mm of thread and then a blank section so they won't screw through the hub.

If there were enough room on the front I'd have drilled out the threads and pulled in some standard mazda studs with splined bit ... no different from how they are fitted on the later rx7s

[Richard]

Coolio, that'll work fine ;)

[MikeLMR]

Wheels are on now ... it shows up all the rest of the bits that need doing ;)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0054sm.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/DSCF0053sm.jpg

suspension next (would have been first if I hadn't found some wheels right off!)

[flectron]

looking cool mike :cool

[OLSKOOLROTAR]

Looks wicked with the black wheels on

[travellinbob]

That looks well tough now MIke!

[MikeLMR]

Cheers for the kind comments guys.

Its still a long long way off where I want it to be but its a step in the right direction :)

I have just ordered some very reasonably priced strut tops for it too. They are very bling and should fit without too much fettling.

Should look even tougher sat a little lower with plenty of negative camber :yes (also got the 2 1/4" spring perches with thrust bearings to suit)

[Ray]

Cheers for the kind comments guys.

Its still a long long way off where I want it to be but its a step in the right direction :)

I have just ordered some very reasonably priced strut tops for it too. They are very bling and should fit without too much fettling.

Should look even tougher sat a little lower with plenty of negative camber :yes (also got the 2 1/4" spring perches with thrust bearings to suit)
Hi Mike,

How much were they?

Ray

[MikeLMR]

£117 shipped to the UK ... about $179 if you don't want the top spring perches and other bearings. once I get a hold of them I'll let you know what they are originally for and how well they fit. I can't see any drama in making them fit the rx7 dampers and the strut tops are very easilly modified.

The centre distance between bolts on these are 114.3mm rather than the 112.5mm I measured so not far off at all.

[MikeLMR]

Ray,
what was the ID of the threaded collars you used to convert the S2 struts ? I have only really found 2" ID ones in the UK

Cheers ~ Mike

[Ray]

That sounds about right, mazda tubes are particuarly small diameter 44mm from memory, so I had to put packing spacers between the strut tube and the threaded tube. I just used a standard conversion kit from TAS, I think that Nova's/Corsa's are a smaller diameter (46mm maybe?), but you pay more of a premium for the kit. Are you getting some uprated inserts?

Ray

[MikeLMR]

yes the RX7 specific kits in the states are like 5 times more. I was thinking about welding some shims in place before the threaded tubes.

I am currently looking at some Tokico adjustable struts (have a set on my rx7) I am wondering if there isn't somthing better about. (probably not if the rx has a small tube strut)

[MikeLMR]

TAS have gone bust :( apparently

was looking at the rally design kits but they aren't meant to be very well made

[travellinbob]

Hey MIke have you seen the 'used' rx8 engine on e-bay? not that I am trying to put ideas into anyones head?!

[MikeLMR]

now you are a bad influence ... but my budget won't stretch that far.

(is it the one with possible water seal failure)

[travellinbob]

Yes it was the one with the water seal failure one. So I guess you will be sticking with the 20b idea? he, he, he.

[MikeLMR]

its the right colour for a 20 Bee too :) (sorry terrible joke)

[MikeLMR]

some more parts of the puzzle have arrived !

Studs to convert the wheel bolts (the bolts are actually OK with the wheels I have ... I checked the thread engagement and the taper seating but I prefer studs and nuts over the bolts)

Threaded collars and lower seats to convert the struts

And

A pair of 180lb/" 12" long springs ... a little longer than I originally planned but I want to make sure the springs won't bind.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/019c2003.jpg

Checked everything over this afternoon and should be taking a trip out to Thoresby Jap show tommorow. (taking the club stand)

[MikeLMR]

strut tops arrived today but the struts have now fallen through so I've got nothing to fit them on.

Notes so far are ...

spherical bearings are FK bearings FKS10T 0.625" ID
They come with an adapter sleeve that doesn't suit a 12mm thread ... need to find one that does or make one
The strut top pattern is spot on ... bolts straight on
The spring hats are for 60mm springs and not the 2.25" ones I have (need turning down)

Just need struts before I can start sorting it all out

piccies (as if I'd forget ;) )

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/2.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/7f333b6d.jpg

[kiwimazda]

Hi Mike.
Just been looking at you pics. Where did you get those top mounts they are sex.
I have some struts you might be interested in. WE have already welded on the 2.25 threaded tubes and they have 300lb front springs and those kyb inserts i told you about.
A good friend of mine in NZ has a 323 with 12a pp power but i think is up grading ti 13bpp. It is a very quick car. I went out in it (must have been 10 years ago) and i thought I was going to die. He then entered it in a hillclimb and was fighting for a top place over all and then inverted it. Hence the rebuild that has taken 10 years.
I am going home for a holidat in Dec so can get some pics
Cheers
Brian

[MikeLMR]

Hi,
they are from techno toy tuning (t3) in the states. No idea what car they are for but the strut top pattern is just about spot on for an early Mazda. The bearing ID is a little off. The guy who owns is it very helpfull and sent me a set that matched my measurements the closest.

I have sent you an e-mail about the struts.

[MikeLMR]

I recut the location diameter on the spring cups today (using a lathe) for some reason they were to suit 2.5" ID springs and not the mega common 2.25" ones :confused:

Hopefully I can get some struts sorted soon and find out what else needs modifying. (knowing me ... everything :D )

~ Mike

[Richard]

Mike have you thought about converting the original struts and then rebuild them using thicker oil. I'm sure you could get a seal kit via a dealer.

We found Castrol GTX did the job:cool

BTW I have a pair of new rears for an SP if your intersted

Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

I'm still working on some Spax ones for the rear.

Unsure about the springs yet, apparently 1st gen rx7 ones fit ? 9so therfor the coil ovet conversions will too.

[Martiny]

mmm, my RX-2 is like a boat ( bouncing up and down!) at the front, will have to do something about the shocks. I wonder if I can get a kit, or, Mike, can you find out if Spax do a strut insert? We used to be able to buy an adjustable insert from Gabriel.

[MikeLMR]

the 323 struts aren't of the insert type design. Not sure about the rx2.

[MikeLMR]

RX3 X-member came in the post today ... not a clue where it bolts on !

hopefully its a little more obvious when compared with the car :D

[MikeLMR]

the 1st bit of rx going onto the 323 :D

... brand new RX3 cross member from Aus and it bolts in perfectly, no need to jack the car up or anything (piddly little jack in the back ground was to push the ARB back into position)

now there the small matter of an rx7 engine and box :3gears-rh

[MikeLMR]

btw its not as rusty as its looks in that photo :eek:

[MikeLMR]

Thanks to Moonwrap (Lynn) for this excellent photo of my 323 from RotorstockII verses the official Mazda press image :)

[daverey]

Mike
just wondered if you would like a complete dashboard from a 1400 sport 323. I just found it at the back of my garage. I originally fitted it to my first Mazda, a 1978 323 hatchback. If I recall it will fit all RWD models.

[MikeLMR]

yes please :)

send me an e-mail if you like

Cheers ~ Mike

[Richard]

Mike - daverey is correct in what he says about fitting all RWD models, as long as you have the dash top as well.
I converted both my 1000 and 1300 323's to SP spec dash - the only thing needed is a feed from the coil to a pin in the multiplug to run the rev counter. IIRC you need to find an actual female pin to fit in the multiplug as there's only the hole there to take it.
Re your master cylinder - can you run an ordinary girling type? (as fitted to hydraulic handbrakes), and also is your tunnel going to need any subtle (i.e big hammer!) modifications to clear the slave cylinder?

Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

not looked at it to be honest :) (on the M/C) apparently its a bolt in swap so I'm not expecting to adjust anything.

The dash looks like a nice easy swap with it being in seperate pieces. (was looking how hard it was going to be while driving down the A1 yesterday)

[Richard]

After getting enormous pleasure from beating a lot heavily modified RS2000's and 205 GTI's at a round of the Welsh hillclimb championships yesterday,I've decided to stick with my 4 potter and not fit a rotary to my 1000.

What has this got to do with my 323 I hear you ask?Well it means that I have no longer any use for this

http://publish.hometown.aol.co.uk/jmazdaman/images/mastercyl.jpg

Before you get too excited its actually a brake master cylinder for a B16, so the question is what bore size do you need? The parts books I have for the RX3 and 4 dont actually list bore sizes,but this one comes in at 0.75.

Also at the investigative stage is a rumour of a 6 point Safety Devices cage for the 323 if your interested.

Cheers,
Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

oooh any photos from the hill climb ? sounds like you are well justified in sticking with the 4 pot, it certainly sounds the part :cool would love to see it at full chat on a rally or sprint ... perhaps a far flung marshalling trip may be in order.

I'm not sure on the M/C either I'll have to have a look in my 1st gen manual and see what the rx7 uses (most likely donor for the slave cylinder)

ooh very interested in the cage ... driving a car without one just doesn't feel right anymore :D

[MikeLMR]

just had a look and the rx7 uses a 0.625" M/C and a 0.75" slave cylinder.

If I am thinking correctly a 0.75" dia one should work as it will displace more fluid per unit of travel. I just need to nip out and look at the 323 in the garage now.

[MikeLMR]

OK keeping with the theme of making this a conversion with step by step piccies ...

Clutch cable mounting (notice how it looks just like the mounting for a slave cylinder :cool )
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/3c4fbbeb.jpg

and the strang 'push cable' clutch the rod below the pivot pushes the cable rather than pulls on it ... so bolting on a hyraulic master cylinder is just a case of bolting it on (and perhaps modifying the rod ... or fitting an rx3/rx7 one ?)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/ce0f3eb2.jpg

anyone would have thought mazda intended it for rotary swaps :)

[Martiny]

Ah, Yes, strangest feature of the RWD 323, a clutch cable that pushes rather than pulls !

[travellinbob]

Hey Mike what do you plan on doing for an exhaust.? i.e pipe diameter, extracters? wall thickness? as the rotories run hotter out the hot side I guess slightly thicker wall thickness will be needed.
Stainless or mild steel? all answers on a postcard. :p
cheers, michael.

p.s. big gravell sprint being run by the 2300 club up here on Mull in january too.

[MikeLMR]

not sure yet keeping my eye's peeled for a 12a header ... or there could be the mystery plan B which could yield all the running gear to get it rotorised ;)

Being a sucker for nicely made bits I'm rather tempted by the 12a header for sale on ausrotary, only disadvantages are its rather short and its merged into a 3" dia collector, so a little OTT for what I was planning.

[mullins]

I'd get someone here to bend you up some. Would be cheaper than getting them from Oz?

[Don Pamponi]

Are you making a rotary powered hotrod there Mike?

[travellinbob]

C'mon Mike, you cant drop a hint like that in your last post and not explain?!!!
What running gear are you thinking of that wont need headers?
tell me more. By the way there are a few 12a's for sale on e-bay at the moment.

[travellinbob]

Hmm, just noticed something totaly irelevent to this topic but as Mike is a moderator perhaps he could explain the feel free to elete this post.
I thought I had about 510 posts the other day but today only have 499? just curious. Dont really care that much but just wondering??

[MikeLMR]

if I delete a post your post count goes down ... I can't explain that lost post at the moment ;)

Don, I am building a sleeper :) ... although a roll cage may give the game away a little LOL ... basically I'm building a car that I like, no motivation other than that :)

[MikeLMR]

still no front struts :( ... fed up, they were in the post and now nothing and no answers to e-mails either

at this rate i'll have the repair panels for the bodywork before the front struts from the UK !! and they took 3 weeks to get in stock !

[Richard]

Repair panels, Mike? Tell me more please
Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

from rare spares in Aus, they do repair panels for the bottoms of the wings.

I can get rear arches and outer sills in this country. I could really do with an inner sill but I figure we can rebuild that good enough seeing as its just at the back end and not really visible.

[MikeLMR]

Struts arrived yesterday evening so I got to trying them on the car today.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/6beba5d2.jpg

looks a little low here but I have had it wound up to higher than standard ride height. Not sure on the camber yet. Must go fetch the gauge from the other garage. I hope its a little OTT as I'm on full adjustment at the moment :eek

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/c252baed.jpg

As you can see the brakes are a little larger than the standard ones and they aren't yet connected. I'm not 100% happy with the strut top setup yet but its going to take a drive around the block to try it out first. The springs seem a little softer than I imagined but the damping is FAR FAR superior to the unmodified side :wiggle

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/ad003459.jpg

Lots to do before its roadworthy.

[Brett]

Are you deffo going 12A still Mike? If not I have a 13b for sale :)
That car is going to be the mutts nuts, when do you think you'll be finished?

[MikeLMR]

I would like a 12a really as its mostly a bolt in job to change over.

No idea when it will be finished ... I've barely started to be honest.

[travellinbob]

What brakes are you running Mike??
Looks quite the 'b' road car and once it has a 12a in it will be loads of fun!

[MikeLMR]

Michael, it will be running with standard drums on the back and the S2 front brakes that came with the struts.

yes, should be a laugh once its sorted :)

[OLSKOOLROTAR]

Hi Mike,
Are you keeping the original colour scheme or are you going for a respray, either way I look forward to seeing it (again) when she's smarting a nice new rotor :cool

Jase

[MikeLMR]

it will be staying Yellow, I'm no good at painting things and don't have the budget to pay someone to do a "proper job" so It'll just be tidied up once the bodywork is solid but it certainly won't be a show car.

[OLSKOOLROTAR]

it will be staying Yellow, I'm no good at painting things and don't have the budget to pay someone to do a "proper job" so It'll just be tidied up once the bodywork is solid but it certainly won't be a show car.

It'll be the mutts at the end of your mod's eitherway :cheers


Jase

[oldone]

Hi ya,
Going back about 10 years or so...we fitted a 13b to one of these 323..in RSA years ago they were very popular cos the 1300 could go miles on tank of gas,hence there were many around and in very good nick...no rust dents etc,cos the weight was ideal once stripped out they really made good street sleepers....the 1300 ran a good diff ratio for grags and the diff itself was bullet bud...never broke

[Martiny]

Hey Oldone, that avatar looks suspiciously like Kyalami?

[MikeLMR]

Hi ya,
the 1300 ran a good diff ratio for grags and the diff itself was bullet bud...never broke

really ... I was expecting it to break in pretty short order ! Thats encouraging anyway as I will be running the standard axle till it breaks

[oldone]

Indeed it is squire,that pic was taken going down "the mineshaft",5th gear full tilt and waiting for the left hander to come up,debating if i should lift of the gas or close me eyes and keep the pedal glue to the floor... :cool somehow me b.....s are not that big so i back off a little heheheheheh :eek

[oldone]

The standard diff of the 323 was however locked (pin not welded)...the desighn is very similar in size and strength as the rx2.....

[oldone]

By the way i got pics of most circuits and in car video of the RX2 at Kayalami !!

[Martiny]

Oldone, I am starting a new thread.

[MikeLMR]

Small update today (no piccies ... sorry)

Welded some new mounting brackets (also home made) to the struts for the brake lines. I also removed the discs and repacked the bearings with grease. The main point of all this dissassembly was however to batter the brake dust guards back straight as Parcelforce did a good job of bending them all over !

JUST got to sort the threads for the brake lines, buy some new wheel nuts, recon the calipers, find some pads and a fitting kit and then get it all tracked up.

Also trying to get hold of some Racing Beat Caster blocks for the ARB mounts and thinking about making some Roll centre/Camber blocks for the bottom of the strut so I can at least run some negative camber !

[oldone]

why not do the adjustments on the top of the strut,so the whole strut is at an angle..you get it to perform better under cornering load and then you also adjust the hub for more camber if you need ? just asking.....

[MikeLMR]

Because I've used all the scope for adjustment at the top to take up the difference between 323 and rx7 struts DoH

BTW Lada Riva rear struts fit on 323's with minor mods ... so I have a pair of bilstein Dampers for the rear Wooo !

[MikeLMR]

(photo for reference) This is full over in the strut top and the wheel is still pretty vertical (not had chance to measure it yet)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/c252baed.jpg

[oldone]

If you make the tower higher then your adjustment angles are more acute.....have a device which you can adjust the camber and you can adjust the whole strut forwards or backwards....great for heavy loads on the brakes cos the strut does not "fold" backwards......you also use a rose joint on the top of the shock and not a rubber bush(sp)....pretty basic cos the adjustments can be made by 3mm at a time which ever way....could take pics and mail....works on the circuit

[MikeLMR]

I'm already running a Spherical bearing at the top :) But I am using the full range of the adjustment to dial out the difference in KPI of the rx7 struts when they are compared to 323 struts.

At the end of the day its only a road car so if its 0 degree's I'll be happy ... if it's positive I'll be on a mission to sort it though !

[Wav]

I'm already running a Spherical bearing at the top :) But I am using the full range of the adjustment to dial out the difference in KPI of the rx7 struts when they are compared to 323 struts.

At the end of the day its only a road car so if its 0 degree's I'll be happy ... if it's positive I'll be on a mission to sort it though !


Looking good mike :D

Think I drove past your house on Saturday as I saw a red rollcaged up 323 parked up just past Lincoln heading towards the coast :chat ;)

Paul

[MikeLMR]

not my house but that was my car ;)

[MikeLMR]

update with photos

I got fed up trying to remove the hub nut from my spares car (spot the fcuked socket) So I got on with fitting the rear shocks on the yella car :) #

(CLICK FOR BIGGER PICCIES)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_79fa6ff8.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/79fa6ff8.jpg)

A nice period accessory thats a must for any car with points ;) this one is from my dads rwd 323 estate :)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_dc35ab3e.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/dc35ab3e.jpg)

The new mounting for the brake pipe (brake pipes yet to be sorted ... probably rx7 ones)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_0e20cd51.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/0e20cd51.jpg)

all cleaned up and straightened :) (dust shields ... THANKS parcelforce!!)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_6cbc8bd3.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/6cbc8bd3.jpg)

Lada vs Mazda ... Lada wins ! Bilstein Rally shocks for a Lada Riva

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_ee57b40b.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/ee57b40b.jpg)

On the car, pressed out the Lada bushes and pressed in the Mazda ones and they fit a treat ... damping rates are just a little uprated !!!

[mullins]

Mike whats that period accessory? :xconfused Does it give a better spark or something? Progress is looking promising, you don't hang about!! ;)

[MikeLMR]

its a capacitor discharge ignition system, basically it takes the load of the points so they last a little (well a lot) longer before they need adjusting.

[MikeLMR]

The car is now sat on its new suspension, the rear is VERY well damped ... I don't know how it will handle with soft springs (standard and standard height) and high rate dampers but thats the setup as used on lots of rally cars so I don't forsee too much of a problem (I hope)

The to do list is a lot shorter now.

to be ready for the Pod in Oct I need ...

- Wheel nuts (to be robbed off my 323 gt spares car)
- Brake plumbing ... need to work out what threads they are first. I presume the old UNF style fittings.
- Brake pads (just require purchasing)
- Brake calipers .... need to work out if I'm going to use these as is or strip, clean and refit them OR splash out on some recon ones (£££'s!!)
- Paint the new cross member and strut brace



Then thats about it appart from setting it all up

[Martiny]

Mike I am sure the suspension will be fine, I am a big fan of soft springs/hard shocks myself. Had this setup on my RX-2 and it handled brilliantly on the track and on the road.

Gonna get this setup for my current RX-2 if I can. At the moment its quite amusing to make the front bounce up and down on the brakes, though !

[MikeLMR]

Just posted off my calipers to a company for reconditioning (at a reasonable price ... will let you all know if they are any good) I also have a set of racing beat caster blocks to fit under the ARB to increase the caster a little (they ended up being V expensive !! ... not sure I'd buy anything from them again ... but then again they are spot on and even come with detailed instructions 6.5/10 :) )

Hopefully the calipers might be back in time for next Sunday (because the rally car has two bent con rods at the moment :D ... Ford = Hydraulic Lock = Bent rods = 20 mins dropped but still finished and still revs to 8K+ :rollin )

[MikeLMR]

no calipers in the post I'm afraid (it was a long shot ;) ) so I'm in the other 1300 323 at the weekend I'm afraid (in the general car park) If anyone is short a pass I can meet up with you sometime mid morning ish (stag do tonight so I'm no way going to be really early :D)

[clive]

Mike, keep your pass and still bring it round and we will hide you on the stand ;)

[MikeLMR]

nice one clive :)

[MikeLMR]

Got the calipers back now and so far I'm impressed. Nicely powder coated black, new pistons and new rubbers all round. Looks like a top job for circa £100 for a pair ! Most places want £100 + each for recon calipers !

So Bigg Red gets a thumbs up so far from me. I also like the fact that they took the time to answer my e-mail promptly and politely ... something a lot of companies seem unable to do these days !

Won't be fitting them for a while though as I'm flying out to India for a week on Monday (work) so I'll be a bit quiet(er) for a bit.

[MikeLMR]

pics just because I haven't posted any for a while ...

[MikeLMR]

garage is now full of **** due to local flooding (water boards fault ... its done it before!!) Not happy as its stopping me working on the cars + its caused a fair bit of damage (luckily not a lot was on the floor) and i have two cars in the drive mid engine swap so I'm a bit miffed about that too

No update pics (I have some but they aren't pretty!)

They best do a good job of clearing up

[MikeLMR]

Bit of an update, firstly many thanks to Davery who donated the SP dash and to Carl who kindly took time out to meet up with me yesterday so I could collect it ... thanks guys much appreciated :wiggle

on with the piccies ...

The reason for the lack of progress lately (see above) ... its still not 100% sorted :( the garage stinks like a drain
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_flood301005028.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/flood301005028.jpg)


This is the old dash ... no tacho = no good :)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_olddash.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/olddash.jpg)

Now with the shiney new 5 dial version ... mmmm (notice the ultralite gauge lurking ... more of that later but initially the fit looks good ;) )
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_dash1.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/dash1.jpg)

The difference in the dash pads
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_dashpad3.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/dashpad3.jpg)

The damage I need to get fixed ... not sure how yet, its distorted here
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_dashpad2.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/dashpad2.jpg)

and split here ... hopefully its fixable :) I'm also going to spray it dark brown to match the original.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_dashpad1.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/dashpad1.jpg)

a NOS pattern front wing
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_newwing.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/newwing.jpg)

a box o bits to sort my front brakes finally
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_newbits.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/newbits.jpg)

and some piccies of the caster blocks installed
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/th_casterblocks.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/casterblocks.jpg)

[daverey]

Glad your pleased Mike, the dash looks right now. Sorry about the broken corner, didn't notice that.
Dave

[MikeLMR]

no worries about the dash I was pleased to find one in the UK! :cheers

[Kaptainbalistik]

Just be careful with the hard rear shocks. It can cause the rear to skip about under power. No weight transfer and all that stuff.

My Rx2 Rallycar at home needs fairly soft shocks to get traction, mind you, It is mental.

[MikeLMR]

I guess we'll find out how it handles pretty soon. All the brakes are now done (as of Monday) I just need to find the time to find 4 more spare wheel nuts in the garage, charge the battery (my battery charger picks a fine time to pack up!) and wire in the new dash then if its dry and fine out it'll be out for a test drive :)

Next on the list is a roll cage, bodywork and maybe some decent seats.

[Richard]

Seen that front wing somewhere before methinks. Any opposition in buying it?

Should have news re: the roll cage next week -unfortunately I've lost the guys phone number :spank but I know he still has the cage :cool

Let you know as soon as I know :Thumbs-up
Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

cool :Thumbs-up

No, no other interest in the front wing. I wonder how many are actually left on the road these days :driving

i've got a few irons in the fire with the dash pad too, option 1) is to repair and option 2) is possibly a brand new one :yes

[MikeLMR]

hmmm thinking about seats, the plan is to closely match the style of the standard ones without matching the lack of support ... the cheapest option would be to stick a set of bog standard bucket seats in but I'm thinking somthing more subtle would be better

these are the options I've considered so far :-

standard piccy first then ...
Mx5 seats (always overpriced and often worn out)
Lotus/VX220 seats (too low ?)

[travellinbob]

I reckon that the mx5 seats would be the better of the 2 choices as the others do look too thin.
cheers michael.

[MikeLMR]

they are my preferred choice ... but they are so damn expensive :(

on another note ... its aliiiiiiiiiiveeeeeeeeee :evillaugh :Party

connected the dash (two plugs) and jumped it from the folks camper battery ("borrowed" for now ;) ) and everything works fine after a bit of bulb swapping :Thumbs-up ace no wiring required !

that went so well I decided to have play at fitting the oil pressure gauge and got most of that sorted bar a bit more plastic trimming to get the backlight to fit correctly ... it'll just need somthing to read the pressure of then :yes

Still no further with the dash pad though.

[metalhead]

Hey Mike, you posted in my suspension post on ausrotary. I have seats out of a series 4 or series 5 rx7. They bolt straight to the 323 rails, with the only complication being that a spacer/adapter has to be made up for the drivers seat as the side bolts onto a hump next to the transmission tunnel in the rx7. Very comfy seats, the brown leather ones I have match nicely with the 323s interiror. My only dislike with them is that they are quite heavy, a lot heavier than the 323 ones. Still, they'll stay in my car a while, but will make way for some thing lighter when I get a bit more serious.

[MikeLMR]

does that mean a set of series 3 seats would fit ?

Been out in the snow in the 323 today :eek ... only up the drive and back though :( so I can get the rally car in the garage to fit an engine thats not been hydrauliced ;)

everything but the battery seems to be functioning which is nice.

[oldone]

auugh you are so brave.... :3gears-rh ..only mad dogs and englishman go out in this weather.. :WaveBye ...errrrrrr and rally drivers... :rollin

[MikeLMR]

been busy busy busy in the garage. Building a new rally car to replace the Lada. the snows not bad but I feel sorry for anyone who needs to get from A to B for work etc. .... its alright for a bit of a play but a little dangerous.

[metalhead]

Well I'm pretty sure series 4/5 seats can go straight into a series 1-3, so I would say so, but I believe they will need a spacer made up for the console side of the drivers seat.

[MikeLMR]

cool, doesn't sound too difficult at all. I can just about remember how the seats fit from taking them out of my 1st gen.

[metalhead]

Yeh, its not hard. The seats i've got literally bolted straight to holes already in the 323 rails. Easiest seat swap ever apart from the spacer, which isn't difficult.

[MikeLMR]

have I really not done anything to this car since 26th Nov :( oops

Well the 323 has been stuck outside in the cold and wet for a bit while my rally car gets fixed (new engine, brakes, hyd handbrake, lines inside car, battery in boot and air filter ford proofed - the cause behind the new engine!)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/small_snow.jpg

poor thing is being neglected :(



Plus we've been a little busy with a top secret rally project ...
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/d20f0454.jpg

[Richard]

Weight is your enemy Mike, but there again,if thats a M***na :2eek :2eek, you need the extra strength :p

Interesting:Thumbsup!

Rich ;)

[travellinbob]

Oooh whats the secret new project? I cant make it out :(

[Richard]

A little bit of inspiration for you Mike

http://hometown.aol.com/jmazdaman/images/img36371uy.jpg

Although the air filter through the bonnet trick was done back in 1980 by this guy in the States

http://hometown.aol.com/jmazdaman/images/usrx323.jpg

Now, where to find pics of a modified 1000 :3Confused :Giggle

Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

oooooooooh I'm inspired!

Michael ... theres a big clue in Richards post ... but shhhhhhhh its top secret.

P.S its not mine and its not a rotary :( but it is going to be cool.

[mullins]

1000 = sexy!

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/886/tryagn7rn.jpg

[ska]

that is just............*spurts*..............sorry! :InLove

[travellinbob]

some very cool pics on this page. Top motorvation for a work in progress.
chers, michael.

[Richard]

Right enough of the drooling and dreaming, lets get this thread back on track. :Giggle

Talking of track - after reading Ray's Oulton thread I have realised that mine is suffering from twitchy handling after fitting the 2 1/4's and running it lower to the ground and, not being entirely up on my suspension design/settings, need some help :3Confused

Mike you say you got the castor blocks from RB -are they RX2,3 or 4 or would I be right in thinking they're all the same?

How much does it drop the ARB, and does it move the bar forwards or backwards in relation to where it was?

Also had a thought on your camber prob - can you extend the length of your TCA's? When I fitted the Ford axle to mine I fitted rose joints to the lower trailing arms to allow axle alignment.

It involved cutting around 3 inches off the body mount end (to do away with the bush) and then welding a piece of angle iron,with a captive nut on it, over the end to take a rose joint, and so allow movement of the axle fore and aft in the arch.

I think the same principle could be applied to your TCA's.Its basically a cheap way of doing this:

http://www.racingbeat.com/photos/14006.jpg

The angle would sit across the width of the arm where the 2 bolts are in the above pic. I used angle iron as it allowed me to weld along the underside, as well as around the edges, giving a larger surface area.

Cheers,
Rich ;)

[MikeLMR]

Hi Richard, the caster blocks pulled the ARB forwards as the mounting on the rx3 323 chassis is angled, it also drops the front of the bar by a few inches.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y219/MikeLMR/casterblocks.jpg not sure if the others kits are the same ? I seem to remember some have offset holes rather than just a big spacer like these rx3 ones.

Heres hoping mine handles OK ... otherwise its going to be a tedious drive down on the 18th :D

[MikeLMR]

Well I got the 323 running tonight and its been for a run down the road, the front suspension seems to be working well, but needs tracking before I am sure.

The rear suspension is not working at all well. I think the safest thing to do at this point is to go back to the standard stuff as the dampers seem to be solid ! (siezed ? ... they moved when I fitted them) I'm also begining to suspect that they are not monotube shocks and/or do not work upside down (they are fitted 180 degree's out to the original fitment)

The electronic ignition box seems to work really well though. And its great to have a dash with a tacho at last.

bit of a step backwards but considering whats changed it's to be expected.

[MikeLMR]

oh and my Dad fixed the wobbly mirrors :driving :King ... by taking them to bits and tightening them up (why didn't I spot that !) Top job :)

[MikeLMR]

bit more cheerfull tonight. Got off earlyish from work and bought the 323 a nice huuuuge battery big enough to cope with any engine I wish to fit in the future, then fitted all the dash back together, doesn't look to shabby even without any restoration :)

Also borrowed the tracking guage so I can get the tracking set and test drive again after refitting the standard shocks. Now on the lookout for some adjustable shocks with a bush type fitting at each end open length 500mm and closed length 345mm.

[MikeLMR]

After the Oldschool mega mini meet I have been inspired to crack on with the 323 and get a rotary in it. :3gears-rh

The parts list is gradually being ticked off and over last few days I've sorted some parts.

Roll Cage - Ex 323 challenge (thanks Richard! + NOS bits)
Oil cooler - Fleabay - from a 2nd gen
SP Rear shocks - NOS
front chrome bumper and bits - NOS
6 port 13b
Clutch
Carb and manifold

Hopefully once we get a free slot in the garage I can get cracking on fitting the cage and giving that rotary a good home !

caged photo (not fitted yet ... just for transport !!)

[travellinbob]

Good stuff Mike. I will race you to a complete conversion. I do have a hrad start but alot more to do until it is finished.
Maybe we could race at rotorstock. (youd kick me ar£e but would look great for the cameras!
cheers, michael.

[MikeLMR]

could be 12a on 12a for rotorstock ;)

[Brett]

Heres one just for you Mike :D

http://videos.streetfire.net/category/Mazda/0/9737A4D7-228B-46DE-A426-5F5CEF6F16FE.htm

[MikeLMR]

ACE :rollin I guess Glenn may know the owner of that car (its off his old website !)

[MikeLMR]

The parts collection is starting to grow now and I've got my work cut out finding all the little bits that make up a running engine from a short block. Luckily I think I can use up most of the bits off my old 12a block :) my only worry at the moment is forgetting somthing important :Yawn

does anyone know if Mazda sell full engine gasket kits or am I going to have to spend an afternoon down at Mazda sat with the storesman ordering them all ?

I think I may end up with an N/A FC parts car ... basically just to nick all the odd little bits off. it'd also give me a better apreciation of where all the senders and pipes and bits go on 6 port 13B ! (I could do with a dummies guide to rotary anatomy ... maybee I should create one once i've done!!)

[mullins]

Yeah Mike Mazda sell a gasket set

[Kaptainbalistik]

I think I may end up with an N/A FC parts car ... basically just to nick all the odd little bits off. it'd also give me a better apreciation of where all the senders and pipes and bits go on 6 port 13B ! (I could do with a dummies guide to rotary anatomy ... maybee I should create one once i've done!!)

Hey , Ill buy the diff off you and the doortrims (Trying to put a rollcage in my FC and need a donor diffhousing for a 94 MX5 diffcentre!)

Go to http://www.iluvmyrx7.com/ for the "Factory" Workshop manual but be careful, I think I got a Trojan from the site.

[MikeLMR]

OK, you can have those bits if I get a parts car, its quite a big IF at the moment though :D

[Kaptainbalistik]

Actually, Does anyone know where I can get a 95 MX5 diffcentre from? the STD diff is not good for getting around flags.....(Mind you, The Hydraulic handbrake works well)

[MikeLMR]

Ebay I reckon.

I've just gone and ordered some adjustable coil over units for the back, they are 20" open length and 12.5" closed length which closely matches the old shocks. I'm not sure if I will need to turret it yet, I'm thinking they may fit in nearly the standard position with some persuasion.

Rich, If you ever need those SP shocks you only have to ask :)

[Richard]

Thanks for the offer Mike :Thumbs-up

Look forward to seeing the coil overs :mmmm
Rich ;)

[travellinbob]

Hey Mike what brand coilovers did you buy. What pundage springs etc. I cant believe that there is sooooo much about suspension I am wanting to learn at the moment. Just want to have a car that even if little underpwered it will handle like poo on a blanket.
cheers, michael

[MikeLMR]

Michael, they are GAZ units ... not a premium name in dampers but I think they will do just fine for me. The company is run by one of the guys who formed Leda


I've gone for some 120lb/" springs on the back I'm not sure if thats going to be too much but I took the view that i had to start somewhere and the 180lb/" springs on the front are quite soft so I'd just go a few steps lower than those

[MikeLMR]

just sorted some 3" racing harnesses ... thats just about all the safet bits sorted. I will be fitting an fire extinguisher too.

This isn't going to be much of a sleeper LoL ! I'm thinking I may as well just buy some buckets seats now instead of some semi standard looking Mx5 ones !

This is the "still to find list"

EGI engine bits - in progress
Gearbox - in progress
Engine gaskets - will order from Mazda on Friday (ouch)
Oil cooler lines - I'm thinking Pirtek
Exhaust pipe - HGV supplier

I may also being doing somthing scary to the front suspension but thats all in my head at the moment :bandit

[MikeLMR]

Some photos of the engine, i would have posted it up last night but it was late.

Coilovers arrived too ... more photos

[MikeLMR]

got some more bits stashed away now

Rear axle and LSD
Propshaft
Gearbox
Starter
clutch bits
oil cooler and lines
+ some wheels and tyres for mock up with the axle so we can narrow it to the correct width

The nice thing about the Dana axles is the hubs are slid over and welded to the tubes, once I cut through the tube all I need to do is machine out the welds cut through the tube and chisel it out, then its a case of pressing it back onto the casing and making sure its all square before welding it back up

I think the half shafs are either going to be resplined proffesionally or if the price is pretty close I may go for some Strange custom halfshafts

The Rally car project was up and running tonight on the fool injection ... had a bit of stress getting it running but it all seems sweet now ... sounds ace with just a 4-2-1 manifold attached :D

Still got quite a few bits to find on the rx323 though

[MikeLMR]

a new coffee table arrived this morning ;)

[travellinbob]

D_I_S_H. those are going to look great mike!!!

[Kaptainbalistik]

Pirtek is a good idea for the Oil lines.

120 pound rears may be a bit soft .

[MikeLMR]

Not long now ... 2 more exams and then its trailering the 323 to Rally HQ ready to start work :)

Its going to be a HUGE job :)

[MikeLMR]

this made me grin when this came through the door ... just got to adjust the metal to suit the paperwork now !!

[mullins]

1308cc :yes

[MikeLMR]

notice they have messed up the the model at some point ... its down as a 1300 DL

[MikeLMR]

Swapped the 323's round in the driveway ... shuffling 4 cars, only two of which start without the aid of jump leads and a battery was fun! All ready for its last piston powered trip to the garage tommorow :D

oh and this is what happens when I leave car parts unattended ! hmmm those wheels look familiar :D

[ska]

You clearly have FAR too much time on your hands dude!!

[MikeLMR]

nothing to do with me (appart from my parts being "borrowed" !)

[MikeLMR]

as of 11pm lat night there is no longer a piston engine in my 323 :D No photos as I wasn't planning on working on it last night !

Busy weekend working on other peoples cars but I may get somthing else done and hopefully grab some photos :)

[oldone]

as of 11pm lat night there is no longer a piston engine in my 323 :D No photos as I wasn't planning on working on it last night !

Busy weekend working on other peoples cars but I may get somthing else done and hopefully grab some photos :)
Hey hey its ****edon free !!!!!!!! Well done bro.....by the way are you a vendor now as you are working on other peoples cars !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :Nono!

[MikeLMR]

yeah I'm trading under Rufus Fook Coachworks ... no bodge too big no shortcut too small :Giggle

[oldone]

yeah I'm trading under Rufus Fook Coachworks ... no bodge too big no shortcut too small :Giggle
Great bud,happy for you............when is there a mini meet up at your place so we can drop the ROTOR in place ?

[mullins]

mike, i have a modified rx-4 front engine bracket. if it's any use to your conversion let me know. ;)

[MikeLMR]

Hi Haden, I've got a new RX3 mount and X-member I was going to use. But I think we are going to use 2nd gen style mountings instead :) Thanks for the offer :)

Era ... not sure when the rotors going in, all depends on the chassis work

[Richard]

Hey Mike, sounds like you'll be needing one of these soon :god

http://publish.hometown.aol.com/jmazdaman/images/rib.jpg

Keep up the good work

Rich;)

[oldone]

Hey Mike, sounds like you'll be needing one of these soon :god

http://publish.hometown.aol.com/jmazdaman/images/rib.jpg

Keep up the good work

Rich;)
Me please !!!!!!!!! :mmmm

[MikeLMR]

Hi Rich,
that engines got your name on it :) I think an oldschool meeting is in order so I can bring it over to you :) No rush really though it'll be quite happy in storage for a while yet.

LoL at the sticker ... its got a 1.3 badge on the back, is that not enough of a clue :Giggle

Got plenty of work done on a mates mini today (changing steering rack :) ) and I have had a little time on the 323 too ... but not in the garage. I did have more done but my laptop threw a wobbly and locked up :(

[Martiny]

Just thinking aloud here... Mike is that x-member and bracket for sale, then? Will it fit my RX-2 with a 1st Gen RX7 12A, and I wonder if it'll make my life easier by saving measuring, welding, etc ! ?

[MikeLMR]

Hi MArtin, I don't think it will fit a 2, the RX3 one bolts up under the angled antiroll bar mount ... theres a couple of photos somewhere on this thread :) It may be for sale once I have my engine in and the mounts made (until then I am not 100% sure if it will be used)

[MikeLMR]

Got the engine bay totally stripped and cleaned today, all bolt on front end panels are off and I have found very little rust :cheers infact other than the wings a few little bits the front 1/3 of the car is almost rot free and very tidy indeed :D very happy with that.

No photos as my camera had flat batteries when I came to use it :Grrr

Tried the S3 rad in for size as well and its going to be a very tight fit LoL its sat on the ARB and the filler cap is marginal on clearance with where I think the bonnet will be ! Not a big deal really it will fit once we have finished ;)

[MikeLMR]

some update photos ;) the scale of the project is just taking hold ! The drawing and layout alone is a big job :)

[MikeLMR]

took a delivery of some parts for the 323 yesterday ;) Also got a selection of hoses through the post courtesy of T-Rex - Thanks :)

[MikeLMR]

Got nearly all of the interior and exterior of the car stripped down today, this is going to be a ground up rebuild now, we may even go as far as stripping the dash out just to make life a little easier when we paint the interior.

A long way to go yet !

[travellinbob]

Jeez Mike looks like you slipped with the grinder! :) Am looking forward to seeing the rear end being fabricated. Top stuff, takes a brave man with committment to do this. Just think of the rewards at next years RSIV when the wheel stands are freaking all the fd boys out!

[MikeLMR]

LoL we've just taken a little bit out for a good look and a measure. It's given me a bit more of an idea and i've roughly sketched out a bit more of an idea. A lot of stuff is going to have to wait till next week due to other comitments.

[MikeLMR]

just finished taking the dash out ... not a complicated dash by any stretch of the imagination but still a pain in the @rse :)

[MikeLMR]

some photos of the dash out + some more parts arrived.

taking the dash out worries me more than doing anything else on this project :Giggle

[MikeLMR]

Have now removed over half the sound deadening tar in the car and have the heater matrix and blower out so we can get good access to the transmission tunnel. Plenty of planning going on now and I reckon the engine might be going in for a "trial" fit (well not exactly in the right place but in the engine bay) fairly soon ;)

[Richard]

Hey Mike - things progressing at a pace here - keep it up

What method did you use to remove the tar?

Just out of interest did you weigh the car before starting the mods - would be interesting to see the difference before and after

Rich

[MikeLMR]

Hi Richard, no I didn't get chance to get the car weighed before hand :(

I have used elbow grease to get the tar out, basically chipping it out carefully with a blunt screwdriver and hammer and then finally finishing off the last 5% with thinners and a wire brush/cloth. NOT a nice job, but needed because of the seam welding, and other fab work going on. It also saves a little weight (I doubt it's more than a few Kilo's)

Been out marshalling last night so the other half of the floorpan will have to wait zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[MikeLMR]

on a slight tangent, this is my potential new daily driver... a 323F V6 I've always like these from having first seen them being PDI'd at mazda when I worked there during the school holidays. I just so happened to spot one for sale on fleabay that was local and going for the right money.

Got to get rid of my old work horse of a 323 now :( its a shame mazda didn't do a better job with the underseal otherwise It's still be a cracking car. Oh well it's done good and won its fair share of the rallies it entered :Giggle

[Martiny]

That new 323 looks very nice. Tried to talk my wife into getting one. We are aiming for Mazda 6 instead.

[MikeLMR]

its being delivered tommorow night :Wiggle insurance isn't too bad either. (even though it is a parallel import from Cyprus ... RAF I think)

[MikeLMR]

chap dropped the car off tonight, fairly tidy and a steal at £670 :) really chuffed with it so far, hope It doesn't let me down once it's on the road.

best bit is it costs me only £90 a year more to insure than my 1300 :Giggle the noise is ace too

[Martiny]

really chuffed with it so far, hope It doesn't let me down once it's on the road.



eh? No way! Mind you they were made when ford had there grubby paws inside Mazda. :-(

[MikeLMR]

Hopefully most of the technology went from mazda to ford and not visa versa.

Not really heard anything bad said against the KL V6's though

[MikeLMR]

bit of progress today, we cleaned the garage (big job! and never ending!) and I stored a load of the bits that won't be going back on till we've painted it. Also found out that the availability of glass for the car is good (probably more sets of glass than there are cars in the UK!) so I think we will be taking out the bonded screen and not having to work around anything :) The cage is going to be ace ;)

[MikeLMR]

engine is in ;) The engine mounting points are bit odd on these 2nd gen engines aren't they !

Anyone know how much is safe to remove from the sump (and put back else where obviously. The 1st gen 12a sump seems to have a much shallower front section.

[MikeLMR]

Right, a photo update (needed some timeout in the garage ... long story, so went out an grabbed some update photos for the thread)

As you can see the engine is sat in the bay for some serious head scratching work. This is not it's final position ;)

[travellinbob]

Awesome stuff mike! looks like you have pretty much got the centre plate of the engine in line with the front strut tops. Nice to see the carb and manifold being used aslo!
cheers, michael.

[oldone]

Looking good bud........:cheers :mmmm

[RotorHeid]

Nice to see my old carby/KN as well!!:eek

[MikeLMR]

looks like you have pretty much got the centre plate of the engine in line with the front strut tops.
cheers, michael.

oh it's going further back than that :evillaugh lots more cutting tonight ... I am really keen to get some constructive work done soon though ... all this destruction is getting worrying ! need to see metal going back in !

We welded 2 30mm box section beams across the chassis rails tonight and as you can see we have bolted in a beefy front strut bar + the lower X member is still in place. Got to try and keep the chassis straight !

[MikeLMR]

got the engine sat further into the car now, probably more than 8" further back than the standard RX3 setup puts the motor. The major problem with this is the X - member ! the engine is sat so high the prop wouldn't fit in the tunnel if we put it in as is ! ... some serious sump/x-member ineractions are going to need sorting I think

[MikeLMR]

OK, some more gory photos, The engine is going to sit a lot lower than it is at the moment, but we ended up in the pub after a serious planning session rather than getting too mucky :D ... lots planned for tommorow night.

I promise we will put some of this back in soon and fill in the gaps :)

(crikey two photos with me in ... must be slipping up!!)

[stuart wizy]

good work mike, is the car going to be used on the road?
or will it be brapping around rally stages and circuits?
I can see plenty of thought has gone into your project, keep up with the photos!

[MikeLMR]

street/strip I'm hoping it will handle pretty well so it might see some corners too :) It certainly isn't going to be a daily driver ;)

[oldone]

It certainly isn't going to be a daily driver ;)
Wissy........of course it has to be a daily driver...:bandit

[MikeLMR]

only because I walk to work ;)

[oldone]

Granted...then it will be a Sunday morning,scare the village folk car then...:3gears-rh :Hammer :rollin

[mullins]

Mike,

Stumbled upon this link. He also has the engine mounted on the suspension crossmember.

http://img353.imageshack.us/img353/4623/julian0060mv.jpg

Might be of some help

http://ausrotary.dntinternet.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=82597&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0&sid=ffa67c5439cc4be69083fe18237ff5e2

[MikeLMR]

thats awesome ... thankyou !

[MikeLMR]

inspired now ... Hopefully I can get the sump and X-member made up this weekend.

[oldone]

Personally i think a mini meet at Mike's is in order...if all the old schooler's get together,fly up there,we could sort that engine location for him in 2 ticks.........whats your add Mike ??????:guinness :cheers :yes

[MikeLMR]

LoL it'll be sorted soon ;)

[MikeLMR]

The crossmember is now braced with a temporary brace and cutout and the engine has the start of a custom sump bolted to it, the engine is now probably sat 80mm lower than it was before and about 6" further back :Laugh

the sump so far is a 3mm sheet which I've profiled to match the engine and drilled for the mounting bolts and drilled a clearance for the large bolt on the front housing. We've now sat the engine in the car and marked where we have to clear the steering so we can build the sump up round everything.

Once the sump is finished the engine/suspension crossmember will be fabricated. I reckon we could fit a few more rotors up front :rollin

Photos to follow as I forgot my camera today :rolleyes:

[MikeLMR]

you will be glad to know that we have started to add metal back into the car tonight :Giggle well it's only the sump but its the start of much bigger things and a step forwards :)

I'll let the piccies do the talking here are the progress pics. There's some more to come out to let me take the top off the carb in situ but the majority of the cutting is done.

I'm also on the lookout for a ballistic blanket for the bellhousing as it's going to be sat next to my feet/legs ! I calculated that I'd need 7mm of decent grade steel plate to contain a full on flywheel at an over rev rpm of 10'000 (if it's going to go it's going to go at mega rpm) 7mm !! I think Kevlar is the way forward, but the tunnel will be 3mm plate around the flywheel anyway. Fook the weight it's gonna be safe.

Engine isn't quite square in the shots as it shifted after we had measured up for the sump and trial fitted the box.

Anyway photos !

[MikeLMR]

Some extra ones (lots of photos today!)

The sides of the sump DO fit it's just that they are thrown together the wrong way round for a quick photo as I left the garage. Hopefully my gaskets will arrive form Mazda soon and I can swap the front cover so that once the sumps on we can make a new crossmember up.

notice the high tech metal folder :yes it runs on elbow grease and big hammers :Laugh

last of the photos

[MikeLMR]

Front section of sump is 270x85x80 and holds about 1.9 litres of oil when full.

The rear section is going to be much bigger, tapered from 85mm-60mm front-back and will have 3 1/2" flexi's linking to the front sump under the steering. Hopefully it will work first time. If not we will make another till it does.

[MikeLMR]

lets have a go at this "posting a video on the forum" thing then, this is what you have to deal with when clearing a steering box/drag link etc ... the engine will sit about 5mm higher than this when it is in to allow for some flex in the mounts etc. (not much I hope as they are going to be fairly solid!!)

Whey it appears to have worked :cheers

[travellinbob]

Awesome stuff MIke! You have enough room at front of the engine for at least 1 more rotor and a decent enough sized turbo :)
cheers, michael.

[flectron]

Even listening to Drive by The Cars while you work.
There's no doubting your commitment Mike. :god :rollin

[MikeLMR]

whatevers on in the background is the local radio station ... Monday is country night uggghhh, not my choice :)

[travellinbob]

I like both types of music. Country and western! yeeeeeha.
cheers, random post for the day...

[DRAGON]

Great work, thanks for the updates!

[MikeLMR]

Thanks for the comments :)

Got most of the sump welded up tonight, need some trial fitting then it's onto final cutting/welding then fitting the drain plug and cross over pipes and cleaning up the outer profile to tidy the job once we are sure it's all good .

Oh and leak testing.

[MikeLMR]

Got looking at sorting out some sort of protection from the the clutch/flywheel today. And got as far as nearly ordering some Kevlar to make our own blanket (double layer of Kevlar, with Ceramic lagging infill all strapped together with some seatbelt webbing and bolted at the engine/gearbox joint)

But then i found a universal Nylon SFI approved one for $80 from Summit racing in the US and ordered that instead :) didn't fancy cutting and sewing the stuff to be honest (tis tuf stuff to work with apparently)

[MikeLMR]

photos are of the trial fit of the sump, engine is just dropped in and roughly in the right place. probably about 10-5mm too high and not square or level but it fits and clears (and still will when it's in properly) which is the main thing.

Now cut the sump plate out for the pans and started to make a pickup, a 1st gen pickup fits just fine but needs the flange rotating by 180 degree's or so.

Got to spend some time bolting it all down before we weld it too ... don't want it to distort too much! Slow progress but lots of engine in and out work and cutting.

Got a neat idea for the engine mountings tonight too :)

[travellinbob]

top stuf mike. you guys should definately turn that little workshop of yours into a car prep buisness!!! That sump looks great.
So what are your ideas for the engine mounts?
cheers, michael.

[mullins]

top stuf mike. you guys should definately turn that little workshop of yours into a car prep buisness!!! That sump looks great.

Totally agree Michael! That sump looks really cool. I'm well impressed! :mmmm :Thumbs-up

[MikeLMR]

So what are your ideas for the engine mounts?

LoL with the amount of time we take and beer/coffee that gets consumed we'd never make any money.

Engine mountings are still in the idea stage but I purchased another 4 poly suspension bushes to make them up when we have a crossmember and finished sump to work around. They won't look anything like the old style rx mountings but will be more like the modern FWD type mountings.

[MikeLMR]

made a blank sheet of aluminum up tonight and sandwiched that between the sump plate and the engine then bolted it all down snug and we welded the sump pans to the plate and b*ggered off down the pub for a pint (well a coke as I was driving) to let it all cool before we remove it tomorrow. We also welded up a new pickup which is basically a 12a pickup but rotated to fit in the new front section.

It now needs a sump plug and few other bits doing, but i think tomorrow we will make a start on the new cross member (woo! more metal going back in!)

[MikeLMR]

Sump was leak tested today and didn't leak at all :) ... all credit to Dave the welder :Thumbs-up

I also spent about 3 hours grinding to remove all the unecessary parts of the suspension crossmember and fabricated a new box section to replace what has been removed. Tommorow we weld the new bits in place and remove the cross member for final welding and gusseting on the bench.

The sump just needs a drain welding in (when we know where it will be accessable) and the cross feed pipes to join the two pans.

OH and if anyone wants to swap a 12a front cover onto a 13b ...they don't fit ... only one of the sump bolts line up and it's a different shape ! Looks like we will be TIG welding some new engine mountings to the 13b front cover on Monday!

[MikeLMR]

Right ... an update with some substance :)

Friday night, we welded up the sump (see photo) and the oil pickup

Saturday, we first leak tested the sump then proceeded to grind some more out of the original crossmember to tidy things up and made up a new bar that fitted in the space that we had available.

Sunday, early start and first of we had severe garage door failure resulting in the whole door (3 car wide) dropping on our freshly painted rally car project :flamed so first task was to make some seriously strong steel wheels to replace the crappy nylon ones that had worn out (to be fair they are very old) about 1/2 hour with a hole cutter and a welder had that sorted and by then Mark had turned up to respray the car and fix the dents !

While the repairs were going on outside I prepared the new crossmember for welding to the original on the car and then Dave welded 75% of it while still on the car. We then took the crossmember off the car and started to box it all back in and gusset the old to the new to make it strong enough.

So thats where we are ... modded sump, modded cross member (not the prettiest thing in the world but it will do) BUT, still no solution to the engine mount on the block itself ... needs more thought before a solution will be found.

anyhow .... Photos ->

[MikeLMR]

last six photos

[MikeLMR]

I got a box full of pipes from california today :D I think they got mixed up and sent me some roll cage tubing ... it's really thick walled stuff :cool

hopefully enough parts to build an exhaust to suit our rather unique engine bay :Laugh


Ian, will send you a cheque for that spare U pipe ASAP as I reckon we will be needing it :guinness

[mpk490p]

Mike,
Just going through the tread, is that a weber 45 carb? on a 13b?
like the suspension set up (i wish!)
Mark

[MikeLMR]

nearly, its a 48 Dellorto. I think a 45 is a little on the small side for a 13B

[mpk490p]

any idea on BHP?
my weber should be going on to a ported 13b so it would be a good comarision?
Mark

[MikeLMR]

not sure on the power, I'll be happy with anything over the standard for a 13B 6 port. At the end of the day if it pulls hard and with no major flat spots I'll be happy. Once it's up and running I may go a little more extreme with the engine (I'd like to now but don't have the cash and this engine is a very good starting point)

[mpk490p]

Know what you mean!
mine is the 4 Port 13b im estimating 200bhp? with the carb but like you say as long as she works and make's me smile i'm happy
Mark

[MikeLMR]

has it been ported ? and what sort of weber carb ? 48 IDA ?

[mpk490p]

it has been ported, i have a weber 45 to go on it, tried to find a 48 but there were none about at the time, pip will be fitting it soon and setting it up so i will et him to rolling road it then
Mark

[oldone]

not sure on the power, I'll be happy with anything over the standard for a 13B 6 port. At the end of the day if it pulls hard and with no major flat spots I'll be happy. Once it's up and running I may go a little more extreme with the engine (I'd like to now but don't have the cash and this engine is a very good starting point)
That dont look right Mike,a carb has to to stand up,not lay down....:spank :Typing